Webinar: Onboarding & the candidate experience

[00:00:06] Well, good morning everybody, and welcome to our session today, which is on candidate experience and really focusing in on how exceptional onboarding is that key to talent, attraction and retention. Really pleased to have such a large audience with us today and hoping that we're gonna have lots of interaction and questions and examples from both our expert panel and all of the audience. Quick introduction to me. I'm Ted Miller. I'm the managing director for our talent management and Talent Development labs here at the Talent Labs. And I'm gonna be hosting the call today. I'll come onto our panel shortly, who I'm delighted [00:00:53] To have with me, but I know we have a number of, members on the call today. But just wanted to give a bit of background to the Talent Labs for anybody who is not a member. And so we're a membership organization focused on that core of your people's strategy. So everything from talent acquisition through management and development. And if anybody would like more information on that, please reach out to the Talent Labs team who are on the call with me today or follow up with us afterwards. And the event today, we're really pleased to be in partnership with Eli Onboarding [00:01:37] Who are not only a partner of ours but they're also an award-winning partner through the Talent Labs Awards. So I'll just hand over briefly to Noel who is the founder of Eli Onboarding, to give a bit of background to themselves. [00:01:58] Thanks very much, Ted. Good morning everyone. Really lovely to be here today. So, as Ted said, my name is Noel Thomas. I'm, I'm one of the founders and director of experience at Eli Onboarding. So Eli is a experience led onboarding technology that's, used in over 150 countries worldwide and onboards tens of thousands of people a year. And we work with some fantastic big clients like GE HealthCare, AstraZeneca, Cognizant, but also small appliance [unclear, likely “smaller charities”] such as Autism Unlimited. And Mercedes-AMG Petronas Formula One Team is another interesting one. So working with a really diverse range of clients, [00:02:36] But all of their goals are to deliver the most engaging and fantastic onboarding experience for their new hires. So I can't wait to hopefully share some insight and knowledge from all across those different clients to, help you develop something fantastic here today as well. Thanks. Thanks. No. And just by way of a really brief bit of housekeeping, so as I said, really would like people to join in, so please do post any thoughts or questions in the chat, feel free to come on camera and join in the discussion as we go through. [00:03:13] The session is being recorded, so you will receive, that recording afterwards to have the content to reflect back on, and we will send out the slides that we're running through today. So you'll have those at the end. We'll try and make sure there's plenty of opportunity to get you involved and get your questions posed the panel throughout. We'll reserve a little bit of time at the end to have an open Q&A as well. So I think that's everything from a housekeeping perspective and what we want from the session today is really [00:03:47] To get into the detail with our expert panel. So Noel is obviously on our panel, has introduced himself. I'm gonna hand over to our other panel members to give a quick introduction to themselves. And so Anna, would you like to start? Yes, of course. Thank you Ted, and thank you for having me today here. I'm super excited to share my experiences. So my name is Anna. I work at DNV which is a global independent assurance and risk management company. We are operating in over 100 countries with headquarters in Norway. We have around 15,000 employees. And why am I here? [00:04:31] I'm here because we've been on a journey as a company. So for the last three years we've hired almost 5,500 people for recruitment and acquisitions. And it's been quite a journey because at the one hand we have the culture of DNV, we are 160 years old, so it's a very rich culture, and at the same time, we wanted these fresh perspectives. So I'm happy to share how we manage that for last years when I've been working here. Fantastic, thank you, Anna. And on the slide for people, if you scan the QR codes, you can link in directly to our panel members on LinkedIn. [00:05:10] Abby, would you like to introduce yourself as well? Yeah. Oh, we've got a squeaky voice this morning. Of course. Thank you very much for having me as well. So I am coming at a slightly smaller scale perspective. So I work for Best Energy, who are a Bristol based tech firm specializing in energy monitoring and management. We've got around 65 employees globally. So I'm very much specializing in how small businesses can operate and how that will affect the onboarding journey and the trip tricks and tips that I can offer the smaller businesses. Fantastic, thank you, Abby. [00:05:48] We've got a range of organizations on the call today from small to very large. And I think the range of experience that we've got across the panel will be fantastic to share with everybody. And last but not least, I'll come to Charlotte, who's also on our panel. Charlotte, want to give a quick introduction to yourself? Yes, thank you. Good morning everybody. Really delighted to be here. I think my experience spans both sort of small and large organizations. And actually while you were talking, I was thinking about sort of 20 years ago when I was asked to sort of plan [00:06:31] And develop my first sort of induction for a set of colleagues and how much it's changed since then. And I think there's different challenges for large organizations than there is for small. But hopefully I can bring some of the things I've seen work particularly well over the years and also learn from others today. Fantastic. Thank you Charlotte. And before we get into discussion, I'll start to pose some questions to the panel. I guess just wanted to cover a little bit of the broader context of what's going on with candidate experience and onboarding and hopefully setting context. [00:07:09] The questions that we're gonna talk through and some of the experiences we're gonna share. From my own personal experience, I've worked across HR for the last 24 ish years in different industries and organizations. And I think the onboarding part of the candidate journey is possibly the most difficult to get right and get right consistently for a number of reasons. I think you've got different experiences by candidate types. So you have those hires that are available and you're desperate to get in quickly, and you may be shortcut the processes and it can feel a little bit frantic [00:07:51] And disorientating. You've got your more standard kind of one month to three month notice where there's possibly more structure, but there are kind of engagement gaps in that process. And then you maybe have your longer periods where maybe it's a longer notice periods a more senior role for maybe six months, or you've got more intense pre-employment checks that take a longer time, or those early talent roles where you've got that longer lead time to keep people engaged until they onboard fully. And it tends to be from what I've seen the most fragmented process. [00:08:33] So you've got more people involved post offer acceptance than at any point in the journey. You've still got the talent acquisition team involved. You've probably got another team in HR looking at pre-boarding and pre-employment checks. You've got the manager more involved, hopefully doing what you want from them, but quite often not. And so it becomes I guess a little bit more challenging for the individual who is joining the organization and the ownership of that part of the journey. As you can see on the slide, there is lots of great data out there and research about the onboarding, [00:09:15] Side of the experience. What strikes me, first of all, is the cost. So the overall average cost of the end-to-end journey is significant. And that takes into account kind of the tangible elements, but also loss of productivity when you're turning over resource. But when you look just at the onboarding elements, the estimates vary by size of organization, et cetera. But it's still a significant, and it's a tangible cost to the organization. [00:09:51] What we're, you can also see in broader research is that, over two thirds of companies are having a dropout rate of 10% or excess. And so post offer, we are losing candidates before they start, and that then compounds that cost for the organization. [00:10:12] And there's lots of good research that shows that actually if you really focus in on that onboarding experience, you can increase the new hire retention significantly and minimize that dropout. Our research that we've done with Eli onboarding in partnership on candidate experience as a whole shows that the impact to the individual and how they talk about the organization is so significant. And a lot of us will know this from just, customer research. We're more likely to talk about a negative experience more frequently and particularly online than we are a positive one. What we see with [00:10:55] Candidate experience is if it is a positive experience, you are getting that level of candidate that is very willing to share that with others. And looking at that general experience, it's very mixed. So you can see from some of the stats here on the slide a lot of employees are feeling overwhelmed during that period, the amount of information that they're receiving in the onboarding process. [00:11:25] Not many are feeling prepared to excel in their roles post onboarding and say whether that's linked with that how much information is coming at them, or how structured the onboarding process is. And 40% saying they didn't have a positive experience, they're actively saying it's not been a great experience. And a third of new starters aren't seeing that structure in place. [00:11:53] Interestingly, we're just about to publish our annual survey and some elements that are picked out here on the slide show that there's a lack of investment in this area, which I think is an issue for organizations, and also a real concern with the broader capability in the organization to manage that pre-boarding and onboarding experience. And so based from a talent acquisition team perspective, but also significantly from a people manager perspective in engaging those new starters. [00:12:27] And there's so much to think about here. I think a, I picked out a few stats again on this slide for things to consider. And we'll start to delve into some of these. I'm sure as we talk to the panel. So whether it's about our communication and engagement, how we are reinforcing the decision that the candidate has made to join us how we're quickly managers to make sure that's a great experience and how we are putting real structure in to ensure that we are getting the outcomes that we want. So let's get into some discussion [00:13:10] And debate on the subjects. What we'd like to do is hear from you in the audience first. So we've got a quick poll which Jordan, if you could launch the poll for us. So we'd like to get your opinions on what are the challenges really, I guess, to creating that best in class onboarding experience in your organization. A few options there. So please pick what resonates most with you and your organization. And we'll run that for about 60 seconds, get some data back from you. And then I'm gonna pose first question to the panel [00:13:50] And say, lots of opinion rapidly coming in here. I can see that lack of ownership is clearly a challenge for a lot of people. Budget is a challenge size and scale and complexity of the project to improve showing up as a challenge as well. So those three seem to be coming out as our kind of front runners from the options there. Just a few more seconds, if anyone's not had chance to complete that fantastic. I think we can share results. And yes, we can see there's some tech challenges as well, but that lack of ownership seems to be standing out as the, [00:14:37] The key challenge for those of you on the call today. So let's turn to our panel then for our first question. 'cause it's clearly from what we've seen in the research it's so important to the candidate and employee experience to get this right, but in your opinions, why do so many organizations drop that ball after offer acceptance? [00:15:11] I can start maybe Ted, if that's all right. Yeah, course. Thanks Anna. Alright. So I have to say that I'm not surprised when I saw the answers because that was my first thought that it's about lack of ownership. So if I'm thinking about the process at our company I reflect that without this clear processing structure, it's really not so easy to guess who's responsible for that and what's the ownership, because as you said that in the beginning, it's it's client acquisition passing the candidate towards the hiring manager. The hiring manager is happy that the offer is accepted. [00:15:51] And then you have HR operations typically already in contact with the candidate. So there are three parties in here and if you do not have the roles clearly assigned it can be a mess actually. So I think that good structure and process is something that can really help for us. We provide that experience through a platform. So it's really easy for the hiring manager and the body to connect with the new joiner even before they join. So this is how we tackle that and we'll, we'll be working towards making that work because these are still early text. [00:16:30] Fantastic. Thank you Anna. And any other thoughts across the panel? I mean, I'm, I'm happy to lean in there. I think the only ING thing is always a challenge for clients. You know, we speak to HRDs, we speak to talent acquisition, we speak to people in learning and development, and they all seem to manage a disparate part of the onboarding process. And often a different stage. You know, TA might be looking at that initial contact and maybe pre-boarding. You've got HR team looking at more of the process sort be not quite as exciting elements of that onboarding, [00:17:06] Experience, getting the forms done, making sure everyone knows what they're meant to be doing on the first day contract signed. And then you've got maybe, you know, the learning and development team who are looking at how we're upskilling people when they arrive and bringing those different groups together. It does seem like a challenge, and I can see that the second one there was also that size and scale and perceived complexity of the project. And it has to be said, it can be quite a complex project to get this off the ground, but I think [00:17:36] That the first thing we always recommend is getting those disparate groups in a room together and creating a shared vision. And I think that's always a really good way to start. What do you want to achieve? And then you can take a step back and maybe approach that project in small steps, you know, so we always talk about dreaming big, but starting smalls, this, especially if you're developing something from a global perspective you know, you're having to take into account the experiences that the wants and needs of different cultures different regions [00:18:10] And everything can seem like it's just, it's too scary to even start, you know, let's just leave it with a contract, a form, and if we are lucky, a call from the line manager. But yeah, I think that's a really good way to start. And it doesn't surprise me luck of ownership is there. It did surprise me though that we, I think we all know, and I bet we all know on this call everyone here today that onboarding is important, but the fact that people still do drop the ball makes me wonder sometimes if people believe a process led [00:18:43] Approach is enough still. That worries me a little bit, you know I mean, obviously we're very biased, we'd argue it isn't, but I think, you know, there's so much research out there, so many stats as you shared with us today that it's just not good enough these days. You know, just having a load of forms, even if you can sign them online, just isn't good enough. [00:19:05] And I'm sure we'll come back to that, all the what makes that great experience. I noted down I love that dream big start small. So we'll also dig into that a little bit. Abby, Charlotte, anything else to add on this one in terms of [00:19:23] Why organizations drop the ball? Yeah, I think I'd add from what Noel just described, that whilst you can create some great processes, I think the bit that's really critical and I found make the differences, being really clear about who owns what when. So, you know, I've been in HR for over 20 years, and I think if you ask most managers, they'd say it was hrs job. We certainly don't see it that way. What we do, when at Mais, we own the onboarding experience for a per [00:20:03] For a period of time, and our management, our hiring managers are really clear how long that is and what we do within that time. The handoff to them then is somewhat managed in that we hold the manager's hand. So we actually planning one month, two month and three month reviews into the manager and the new starter's diary so that they have to meet and review and see how things are. We've created a form for them to do that. So I think there's a, something around beam system led, there's something around your processes being understood and delivered. [00:20:42] And then there's something about just remembering that you know, how would you wanna be treated? I always think that, how would I wanna start an organization? What would I need and want? And how do I make sure that's what's suffered to all of our new starters? [00:20:58] Yeah, I agree with you there, Charlotte. I think, you know, this is the candidate's first introduction to the company culture, company values, and it's so important to make a really good first impression during this process. I think having a focus group is a really great starting point. Bring people together for an example role, have a look at the process, create a plan of, you know, what the ideal candidate experience is on what tools the business has available to make those work. So whether it be an a TSA HR system, or even things like Google Calendar, Trello, some free tools [00:21:31] That are really good resources to help build that process in. Fantastic. And it lots of comments in the chat that link to what you're saying there. So I think that view that it's hrs role and the lack of understanding in the hiring or people manager population of what they own in the process and actually the impact to them if it goes wrong, and the benefits of getting it right. So I want to step us up from those challenges and I think link to what Charlotte just said, you know, thinking about it from your perspective [00:22:15] And from the company's perspective, what are the key elements that make that great experience? Well, I'm happy to add to what I was just saying. 'cause I think we've just recently made some changes, as Abby said. We're constantly looking at our employee life cycle, our experience throughout and thinking how can we do things better? Where are our gaps? What does our data tell us around why people are leaving and when they're leaving, and what can we do to, overcome that? And so I think we've just put in a number of new things that we're trialing to sort [00:22:59] Of see whether they make a difference. And that's around, again, learning from what we've heard already. But I think what we're, we're trying to do is close the gap, so train managers so they understand what they need to do. We've started to almost change the way we interview as well, thinking about how do we engage people [00:23:25] Pre-employment is that sort of part of the onboarding cycle? And so whilst I know for a global organization it might be more difficult, we've sort of said, do we need to do teams interviews? Yes, it seems really easy for everyone, but wouldn't it be better that the person comes in and lives and breathes what we do here? And so we're inviting people in to spend time with people across our organization so that they can understand what we are about and they can we earn us. Then it is almost a day of sort of induction like activity. [00:23:59] And the feedback has been so positive that people have gone home and said, you know, when can I join you? I really wanna be part of this business. We also have tried to think about what are those top 10 things you need on your first day? You know, how do I get on the VPN at home? And what are these five acronyms? And creating this sort of new starter FAQ guide to just try and take out all of that sort of first few weeks of how do I do this and what does this mean? [00:24:32] So just practical things to help somebody to really immerse themselves in your business from day one. Yeah, I'd agree with you there, Charlotte. I'd say that simplicity and communication is really essential. So what does the, you know, what does a candidate or the new starter need to know and how do we communicate that in a, an interesting way to them, whether that's face-to-face, whether that's, you know, actual meeting, if it is someone, who's remote. But also the other tools available like a, an onboarding document. We've got a fantastic one. I'm, I'm a big fan of it, I must say. [00:25:06] Where we have like key terms and things like that is a tech business. There's a few complicated terms, even I haven't still got my head around. But there's, you know, it's a jargon buster. So something a little bit fun, little bit interesting to get people to start thinking about their journey within the business. So yeah, there's, there's lots of really interesting ways of having that big communication. Fantastic. Thank you. To note Hannah in a second, I just wanna pull a comment from the chat, which I think underlines this and some of the points you've touched on that. [00:25:38] I think sometimes onboarding is seen as a process rather than less human experience. So really thinking about the individual in the process and what they need to be both engaged and informed and prepared is so important. Anna, I cut across you, so Yeah. I was just thinking that for sure, getting the basics rights right, is important and crucial, but then it's also about this human experience. So we've launched our employer value pro proposition, quite recently. So we are very much into checking whether the promise, that we put out there really reflects the reality [00:26:21] That they experience. And it's not easy because it's a beautiful promise, of course, with buildups, with our colleagues. So it's based on research, but then when you think about it you really want to make sure that they that they feel it when they come. So for me, it's very much about the sense of belonging. So how we do that, we provide online sessions for our colleagues where they can meet their peers and other people who really live and breathe our values, our purpose, when they can very quickly share what made them successful, at our company, [00:26:59] And most importantly, how they grew within DNV. So what was the reason for which they actually could link their professional goals with company goals? And we know from research that this is one of the biggest things when it comes to correlating intent to stay, with growth. This is something really huge, and it's also part of our promise. So we make sure that they can hear real life examples from our colleagues, and we have plenty of them because people are really proud of the work they do, and they are super happy to share it. [00:27:34] So the sense of belonging and social element of it is super important, And I love that link to professional development and growth, and that's such an important factor in people making a decision to join an organization. So if you can build that and stay, so the onboarding process should really probably cementing a promise you're making in your EVP, because lots of organizations are starting to focus on that as a key differentiator. Mm-hmm. I think we've got a we call it a eight stages of a great onboarding experience. So it's kind of a, in essence, [00:28:18] They all concept, all combine together. They're not really set points, but it's this understanding of creating sort of moments of magic every step of that pre-boarding and onboarding experience. You know, so that ultimately an individual goes through a consistent process that there's points that they want to talk about, you know, and one of 'em might just be as simple as a call from a line manager, but the line manager knows, obviously that's part of their role. I know they might be ensuring that someone's there to meet them on their first day. I mean, we're talking about really simple stuff here. [00:28:52] You know, it's not about all singing, all dancing. There's not a marching band when someone walks in the office, but just getting that process in place and ensuring that, and I think, Charlotte, you mentioned this earlier, ensuring that everyone understands the part they play in that process, and you don't need a fantastic award-winning piece of technology to help deliver that element. It, you know? So if you are starting on your journey to enhance your onboarding experience, just look at the process, look at what you've got in place now, and then start to pick [00:29:24] Where you can put these lovely moments, these touch points in, so that they create that consistent process, but also that really memorable experience. And the human bit, I mean, I could talk forever on these subjects, but the human bit is really critical. It shouldn't just be digital based. It, there should be a human side to everything you're doing. You know, people don't buy an AI chat bot, you know, they buy the people they're gonna be working with, they want to connect with their line manager, major, blah. They want to know who their peers are, [00:29:59] Who's gonna be working in their team, you know? So I think the more of that face-to-face element you can bring back, or building in time for relationship building, even if you run a hybrid or remote organization, build timing for that team building is really critical in order to ultimately make that person feel like they belong. And I think that for me, that's, that inclusivity and making people feel they belong is the, is the real goal you're aiming for with a good onboarding experience. [00:30:32] And I guess there's a number of things we've already started to pull out. I'm gonna turn the panel's attention to practically how can organizations move stuff forward? So we're talking about a, an experience that's very human at the heart of it, but underpinned by brilliant basics is what I'm hearing. So we don't drop the ball, we deliver what's needed for that new starter, and we wrap around that a really great overall experience with them at the center of it. Which, yeah, I think you'd have most of the people on this call nodding away [00:31:09] About that's what they want. How do you get from where you are to that type of experience? How can organizations get it right? I think it comes back to having that focus group, having that communication, finding out, you know, what works for different departments as well, because what may work for one may not work for another. You know, this is certainly, you know, easy to do with a smaller organization. So I completely empathize that there's larger, you know, organizations that don't, that have further challenges than this. But I think, yeah, having that communication, having some examples of [00:31:47] What onboarding journeys look like in different departments, and then how you can utilize that across the wider business and tailor to make it personal. And like you guys have said, you know, human to the organization with check-ins and such, like, [00:32:02] And Abby, I think that sounds beautiful. And I told you already that I envy you, that you are in a position where you have a small organization, you can really take care of everyone. So I can speak from my experience, which is with larger organizations. And here now I heard you say that technology is not the most important thing, and I do agree, but it does play part in it because if you're looking at something that is structured, that is global, if you are looking for consistency, it's easier when something supports you on the way. [00:32:33] So practically what we do currently, we open up within the pre-boarding phase in a way that hiring manager can or can access and can email to this. And by the way, this welcome email is the most app appreciated touchpoint by our employees both from line manager and a body. So this is something that we see in our research internally because we do gather feedback from our new joiners on a regular basis. So what we do, we encourage line managers to make sure that they reach out. Now we are doing that for the platform, [00:33:12] But it can also be a call. It's, it's perfectly fine, even better. Then they also have an opportunity to assign a body. So part of line manager's responsibilities, and I, we know they're busy people and they're happy with that to delegate part of the responsibilities to a body who can also be someone who guides you for the culture and getting to know settling within the company. So this is what we are trying to do already when they accept the offer before they join. Mm, I can see Sarah in the chat, my colleague rolling her eyes when I said technology is an [00:33:51] Important you know, I think for me that Was the, that was provocative though. I know. Yeah. I think for me, technology is the enabler. I think that's the thing. I think you're right, Anna. I think the more employees who are coming on, new employees that are coming on, the more difficult it is to deliver consistency. The less control you have over the people who are supporting the process, line managers being an obvious target there, you know? So ultimately that is where technology can help. It can also help from personalization as well. [00:34:25] And I know one of the stats you had up there, Ted, was about 81% of employees feel overwhelmed by the information during onboarding. You know, personalization can help with that, but also can pre-boarding. And I think, you know, people talk about pre-boarding onboarding for me, they, that they come together, but ultimately the amount of engagement we can track through our system shows people are just desperate to find out more information after straight after offer. So using that period before they join as a way to drip feed content and information to them and to create those connections is a brilliant, [00:35:04] Brilliant way for you to instantly and enhance your experience and also create that differentiation between your competitors. Now, if you think about that, the rise in the AI candidate at the moment, more and more people apply for more and more jobs, or their AR bot is doing that. You know, we're seeing a lot more ghosting, all those kind of things. [00:35:24] Reboarding, is this your opportunity to shine, to create that connection that might not have been there, especially if your hiring process is almost a hundred percent digital as well. You know, there's many organizations out there who have moved volume recruitment onto a fully AI or automated system. So at what point are you creating a connection with that candidate? So they actually care about you as an organization. And for me, that's offer accepted. That is your moment to go, yes, you've made the right decision. Let's create a big, you know, song and dance about you saying yes and, [00:36:03] And start the process of you joining an organization in a really exciting way. Mm-hmm. Fantastic. Thanks. No, and I just wanted to pick up a couple of comments in the chat. I think obviously huge varieties of difference in organizations, how much resource you have in the HR team dedicated to this, and some with dedicated onboarding teams, others without, but at the, a really interesting comment, because we've touched on training line managers and hiring managers on their elements of the process, but they also having a really clear structure with the HR teams coming out from the chat. [00:36:46] So whoever's involved being very clear on their involvement and giving dedicated training into those roles or teams. So not kind of assuming, I guess, that the HR team knows what they're doing and they've got all of this cracked, and it's just the about the line managers. So I thought that was really interesting. [00:37:10] I'm going to open up to questions from our audience shortly, but wanted to move on to I think you kind of touched on some examples already as you've given answers, but are there, are there any additional examples you would you would share across the panel that you either seen or been involved with that have made it a huge difference and doesn't necessarily have to be a huge example. Thinking back to Noel's comment of dreaming big and taking small steps. And before I move us on to looking at how we track and measure the processes [00:37:54] And the experience, I wanted to just give that opportunity to share anything else that's top of mind in terms of those examples of great practice. [00:38:05] I think I can share, oh, sorry. No, go On. That actually refer, referring back to one of your points on about buddying. I think that's, you know, that's fantastic. And we certainly introduce candidates to their, you know, if they're successful office stage, we invite them to have a chat with people in their team. I think a buddy works extremely well, so yeah, just, Yeah. For us, definitely one of the things that, are the most appreciated by our colleagues one of the touch points which are the most appreciated is, the body support. [00:38:37] This is something that really makes a difference. And I was thinking about my personal experience actually, and it's not connected to technology as such. When I joined DNV eight years ago, I was approached by my former manager by email saying, hi, hello Anna, we are waiting for you. And by the way, we are having a Christmas dinner. Would you like to come and meet us before you join? And I was like, oh my gosh, that's excellent. And, you know, and it stays with me. And that was something that really it was a moment that mattered to me that he did extra effort to do so, [00:39:12] And that didn't cost a lot. Like it wasn't part of the process, it wasn't part of the technology. It was just this human touch that he approached me with. Right? So I think that regardless whether you're a big organization or small, you can do small things that matter, right? Mm-hmm. I think such a good point. And they're not the challenges we get, but often we get back, you know, from line managers, oh, I didn't know I could do that. You know, it's kind of like, that's a good point. Mm-hmm. It's, it's, it's, you, they feel worried about inviting [00:39:42] Or doing or things like that, but that, as you've just described, that's such a lovely experience and you're now talking about it eight years later. So again, I think a lot of this goes back to me about that supporting the alignment and just helping them understand the importance of onboarding, what their role and responsibilities are, but also that they have flex there, you know, because that some people will shine in those moments, and that's when you get advocates of the business before they've even joined the waxing lyrical on LinkedIn and other social media channels [00:40:14] That are available you know, and really helping build your employer brand before they've even joined. And obviously that has knock on effects on your referral scheme and everything else that goes with it. So, you know, I'd say, yeah, supporting line leaders to understand what they're doing there, but also, I mean, one of our clients cognizant they, a line managers have a role, but then they also have a development manager and a technical manager who are involved straight away as well. So this spreading responsibility around, so we're all busy people. It's like, oh goodness, I ain't got time to do that. [00:40:49] So think about the key elements to your onboarding, and actually, does the line jet have to be responsible for all of it? You know, we've talked about a buddy already, but are there others involved in the organization that might, you know, start their role on day one, but actually how do we build those connections again and spread some of the responsibility around to make everyone's life a little bit easier? [00:41:15] I'm gonna come to a kind of final question that have planned around tracking and measurement and engaging the business, but I wanna pick up a comment in the chat. I'm gonna turn into a question because I think it's a really important one. See a comment about the focus on onboarding and pre-boarding externally but not enough focus on those internal leaves and what that experience is like. So any thoughts on how you level that up? Because that often is the weaker the two processes in organizations. [00:41:56] So it's in, it's interesting, we get asked this a lot. Can you support us with that? And absolutely. You know, we do support organizations with other internal bees. I think it needs to be treated like any onboarding, I would say, particularly if it's cross departmental or other elements would be when someone's moving from a non-management or people leading role into a people leading role. I think it's super critical, you know, to ultimately onboard that person into that thing. And, you know, similar things happen when people move cross country. So again, I'd, I'd start with sitting down with [00:42:32] Relevant stakeholders and just having a bit of a brainstorm about what is gonna support people through this process, and then, and then how can we deliver that? And that might be through some fantastic technology. It might just be a process that manage is managed through your LMS, you know, for instance, if these people are there, whatever. But just building that process and then ensuring that the support every step, I think is a really good place to start. We actually haven't yet get there in terms of covering that for our onboarding, [00:43:03] But it was through rise many times like within the people function, what about those who are moving internally? And I think that this is something we would be happy to tackle in the future, but there are very different needs of those people. So I think that this would be something that we would need to do for some co-creation to really understand the persona, the needs of those people because that's a different experience probably that they need rather than new joiners from the outside, right? Because they already know the organization very well though at our company with six business areas, [00:43:39] You can change your role, change your business area, and you're in a totally different world. So there is something in it as well within large organizations. Yeah, Definitely a lot of organizations I've been talking to from our membership recently large complex groups with different brands, different products across different areas or different services. And that movement between the group is often a challenging one for people. So they don't see enough lateral movement. But we could veer into a whole different subject there around how you promote that internal movement. I think what's really important is thinking about what [00:44:20] That experience is like from an onboarding perspective into that new role, whether external or internal. Fantastic. So last sort of structured area, oh, sorry, we can jump in there. [00:44:36] Like just me, last kind of structured question I had for you guys was around from your experience, how do you measure Charlotte, you mentioned this earlier on, you look at specific data and you focused on improving based on that data. So how do you measure and track the success of this period of the candidate and employee experience? [00:45:07] First, I'm, I'm, I'm happy to share what our colleagues within the business how they are approaching that. Because I think that this topic, like if you think about measurements in hr it's sometimes it's some fluffy stuff. Here you can really calculate the ROI, the return on investment. It can be attached to the revenue eventually. So clearly there is a business case in here, and you can put numbers on the table. So what our colleagues within the business are doing our people managers within the business areas, they're actually measuring so-called time to production which is checking [00:45:50] When their people are able to perform within so-called chargeable hours, meaning working with clients. So they have their specific targets, percentages of by when we think that the person would be, let's say, 60% chargeable, 80% chargeable, and we, if you can provide a great onboarding experience and you can prove that you move the needle and they are ready earlier by one week, that's quite a success, right? So these are the measures that we are tracking within the business, if possible, because every role is different. It's easy when you have those co those chargeable hours. [00:46:28] It might be not so easy with some other roles when you're not working, like that. But that's one example, at least Thank you Anna, and interesting that you have got the business tracking that rather than, you needing to track and presenting our data to them from hr. So you've obviously engaged them in the importance of that, the benefits that they'll see, [00:46:54] They see, they see just a returning investment in that and don't need to even, you know, encourage. So yeah, Excellent. Nice comment in the chat. Great way to encourage hiring manager accountability. And I think that's, that's key is they think about the context for the hiring manager and what they need in terms of performance. And if you can talk to them about that and get their understanding of the benefits, then you're more likely to be able to show that return on investment. It will be different for different organization organizations and roles. But that's an area definitely to focus on. [00:47:30] And Noel, Abby, Charlotte, any other thoughts on this area? I mean, I'd say, you know, first and foremost, if you're looking at enhancing your experience, start tracking everything you can now, you know, both through onboarding surveys and any data like this, like the stuff that Anna know has suggested. Because ultimately though, you know, this amazing onboarding experience, you're gonna deliver it. It's gonna be you know, rated by the new hire on all sort of engagement, their wellbeing, how inclusive it is, the knowledge and development you're gonna help them, you know, [00:48:07] Drive during that process. The real business benefits for us are our performance, like what Alice mentioned, it's about reducing early attrition. It's about reducing dropout and ghosting. It's about reducing admin and headaches and all those kind of things. And those, when you start to have an impact on those figures, you can, you know, it's a real financial impact on the organization. So, you know, one of the largest organizations we work with tracked a 21% year on year reduction in global first year attrition. And that was a 6 million pound cost saving for them. [00:48:45] And then say similarly, but on the other end of the scale you know, we worked with a charity called O Unlimited, and they had a 9% reduction attrition from sort of 20, 6% down to 16%, I think. And that was about just over 20 people a year. They didn't have to rehire, you know, and I think earlier you were saying 30,000 pounds to rehire a new person is the cost to a business, and you're talking hundreds of thousands of pounds for a charity there, which, you know, obviously, so we are not talking small numbers here. [00:49:15] And I think if you're, you're trying to put a business case together at the start for why onboarding is good that there's no denying it can have a massive impact both from a, an engagement and new hire perspective, but also from your business's bottom line, I think, [00:49:33] And a number of interest element elements to that. There's that productivity efficiency gain that you can you can drive in the processes that a value of not having turnover. There's the productivity gain for individuals when they get into the, to their role and they're able to deliver. So lots of tangible measures that you can put together, not just a really great business case, but also track over a time and demonstrate return. Fabulous. We have a few minutes left, so I'd really encourage if there's any burning questions for people, jump on screen and ask away to the panel [00:50:15] Or if you wanna share some of your experience or drop the questions into the chat. And I'll just, Abby Charlotte, any additional thoughts on tracking success measurements? What's helping to inform where your focuses are? Yeah, so I think, you know, we use our HR system to complete surveys for new starters you know, like a 30 day, three month survey to see how people have integrated. But I think, you know, where possible it's also good to make that a human connection. So have one-on-one feedback with the hiring manager, with the buddy, just have that communication [00:50:55] And then report it into the onboarding of the people team is really beneficial. Yeah, and I think we do very similar, obviously any data that we can capture and analyze we do. And if that can inform any part of the onboarding experience, then we'll look to, make improvements. We've recently reduced our probation period from six months to three months because we had feedback that people were competent at three months and we didn't need to wait till six months. And actually the stress that caused for individuals thinking ahead to six months, am I gonna be here still? [00:51:37] And I've, you know, invested in this business, it could take some of that concern and stress out, and managers were happy that because of the, on partly due to the onboarding experience and the way we operate, that actually people could be signed off at three months. So that's been something we've seen [00:51:58] I suppose measure the success partly of our onboarding experience. That's, that's really interesting, Charles. Sorry Ted. And just there's been research done recently by Qualtrics actually, which talks about the most disengaged tenure of employee is that six months you know, the most disengaged, the wellbeing is the least they feel the least included and they are the highest pretend to go. So little decisions like that instantly, they're thinking longer term, oh, brilliant. At three months I'm in you. [00:52:35] I think you generally don't then, don't you, I mean mm-hmm. Three months is a fair period of time to understand whether somebody's operating at the level you wish. So rather than elongate it and you know, put them through extra stress, why would not sort of sign it off early. And it, and we've had really positive feedback from people as well. That's a beautiful example, Charlotte. I really love it. I also heard of organization which teach that probation period, but I'm not sure of the legal implications in all the countries here. So I'm not recommending that, [00:53:10] But three months sounds very reasonable. It's coming anyway, so we may Yeah. And Interestingly links right back to one of those, stats I shared earlier on that there's, there's disconnect with what's happening in organizations in terms of the length of the onboarding period, and what HR is seeing is what that length should be. So there's possibly some influence needed there to say this is, this is not just about from offer to start, it's about from offer all the way through to being competent in role and settled in the organization, which, you know, that can be 3, 6, 9 months. [00:53:54] I know for some of the roles that I've looked after in the past, you've got intense training periods for very technical or high safety impact roles that last nine to 12 months. So I think it, you really need to focus in on making that a longer experience that you track and measure and you have all those touch points and love the comment in the chat that latest one about just the feedback that organizations are getting on their face-to-face check-in meetings during the first few weeks. And I think that's so important that you [00:54:32] I think you've all mentioned it, Charlotte said that the putting in specific structure to drive that, and so it's not just about a day one induction, and then off you go, there's there's a number of touch points that you're doing to ensure that people are ing well and they've got what they need. And I'm conscious we've got a couple of minutes left and oh, someone's asked who holds check-in meetings, hiring managers, HR or someone else. And for me, I dunno if it's different across the panel from your experience, but add one really well equipped people, [00:55:09] Managers who are doing that because that relationship is statistically shown to be the most important to retention in an organization as well as performance. So started from the from the very beginning, made sure those check-ins, restart happening from the manager and then they're regularly happening through that opening period in employment. Thankfully fuel the, somebody's agree, Michelle agrees with me in the chats. That's good. Supported, Said, supported by the product experts as well, I guess. [00:55:46] Brilliant. Well, look, thank you so much to the panel 'cause you've given really great insight to what you are doing, what you're seeing how you can focus on it, improving that experience. I've taken loads of great notes on some of the key takeaways here. So, you know, right through from that very opening conversation about ownership how you think about designing the experience, making really human love, dreaming big and starting small as a concept and also that human experience underpinned by brilliant basics. But there's so much to this. I think what I'd like to do is summarize some [00:56:24] Of those takeaways with the panel and send that back out to people as a follow up with the slides and the recording. And I dunno if there's any last kind of takeaway points from our panel that you would summarize before we close. But I think a really fascinating session and clearly one that people are really engaged with for their organizations with the amount of commentary in the chat. So yeah, any closing words from our panel? [00:57:00] I mean, I just, I think, I think your first point there was the big one for me, Ted, take ownership. That doesn't mean you then are responsible for delivering and changing this whole thing, but make that first step and take ownership and ultimately from that great things can happen really.